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GrinFX is available?

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xpirator
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Hi.

Is GrinFX available?
How can I run some examples of GrinFX which has introduced at JavaOne 2008?
Is there anybody who can tell me a little about the ongoing progress of GrinFX?

Thanks and best regards.

- Richard

Message was edited by: xpirator

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xpirator
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Thank you for your considerate reply.

I've developed a poor IPTV frameworks in Java, but works very well on MHP, tru2way, and etc. :p

A few months ago, I've started to develop some applications in BD-J. Actually I knew about GRIN before, at this time I want to find the possibility of GRIN as a general form of interface to develop BD-J application.

I think GRIN is simple(but the script is not that easy to learn), beautiful and so fast. It is the best I've ever seen in IPTV platforms.

I just want to keep following up with the study of GRIN. That's all. Thank you again.

Best Regards

- Richard

billf
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As far as I know there's no work on GrinFX. I've been away from Javasoft/Sun for about half a year now, but still I'd be surprised if there were activity on that front.

But let me probe a bit as to the motivation behind the question. What are you looking for?

I think that GrinFX could have potentially done three things:

* Given a more user-friendly syntax to describe a GRIN scene graph file
* Provided a different scripting language
* Given access to a GUI building tool

Of those three, IMHO the third was what would have had the most value. A visual tool that lets you assemble a screen graph and attach the right kind of scripting in the right places is something that GRIN would definitely benefit from. There may be commercial alternatives here, though; if they so choose I'll let the relevant companies speak for themselves :-)

In addition, support is incredibly important for a technology to thrive. I guess that if GrinFX had been pursued, that might have implied a promise of more support. But that's not really part of the technology. Also, again, there are potential commercial alternatives here.

As to the scripting language, I understand the case that's made for JavaFX -- bind is a neat idea, and some of the other language constructs probably do help with expressiveness in a way that leads to better productivity. That said, Java is also a highly effective scripting language, when you use it as a scripting language (which GRIN does -- see, for example, java_command in the text file format). Speaking completely theoretically here (which is all I can do, since I don't have the faintest idea of the commercial success of the JavaFX language one way or the other), JavaFX probably is a good fit for rich internet applications. However, that added expressiveness comes at a pretty substantial runtime cost. For the web, where PCs have ridiculously fast processors, you can support that runtime cost without breaking a sweat. On a Blu-ray player, the equation is totally different. So, personally, I'm very skeptical of a high-overhead runtime like JavaFX in this space, or in similarly resource-constrained devices. BTW, the same goes for whole families of "higher level" languages -- usually as a language they're not really better than the Java language, and usually they come with big runtime overheads. Flash and the HTML/ECMAscript combo fall into this category.

About giving a more user-friendly syntax to describe the GRIN scene graph file, that's neat, but trivial. There are probably six or seven good way to describe a graph structure: XML, some sort of yacc-like grammar (like the GRIN text file format), statements in a programming language, and others. Personally I find text grammars easier to read, and while the GRIN grammar could be made more readable, it's really quite serviceable as such things go. XML is fine, too, and has some minor advantages when you use an XML editor. But the superficial syntax is just that, superficial -- it just isn't that hard to learn a syntax. The interesting (and hard) part is understanding the underlying structure, and that's the same no matter the syntax.

So anyway, I think it's quite likely that GRIN with Java as a scripting language probably gets you 90% of what GrinFX promised, and that other 10% (things like bind and other neat FX constructs) probably would have been really expensive in terms of performance anyway.

Bill Sheppard

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xpirator
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It is good to share about FX TV.

I hope Sun/Oracle's platforms will get GRIN support soon.

Thank you, too.

Best Regards

- Richard