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2 New Committers

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rbair
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Hey everyone,

I'd like to welcome Richard Osbaldeston and Karl Schaefe(r?) as our two most recent SwingX committers. We've watched their contributions for a while and think they'll make a great addition to the team.

Cheers!
Richard

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rbair
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Joined: 2003-07-08
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> I'm thinking swing-layout, swingworker, wizard,
> beansbinding, appframework etc.

There shouldn't be a problem getting these projects up there. Jan, if you like, let me know when you get back from vacation and we can tackle this.

Richard B.

(hmmm, maybe I'll start signing as rbair)

rah003
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Joined: 2004-05-26
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> (hmmm, maybe I'll start signing as rbair)
... or you can try to sign as RichOne ;)

rah003
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>Talking of packages/projects I do find java.net CVS a bit of a pain to work with in IDEA ..with some
>many projects at the top level it's really slow - are there any aliases I can use instead? svn support?
What exactly is slow? Checking for new versions of the files in CVS or getting new files?
If getting files is slow then I'm afraid there are not many options left (maybe setting up a mirror of cvs?) if it's checking for newer version of the files most of the projects have a mailing lists to keep you informed about commits to the project base. Alternatively rss feed from continuous build could be used to see whether there is anything new or not.

> Similarly It'd be useful for me to able able to keep several of the swinglabs projects and related jsrs
> up-to-date (currently I'm doing this ad-hoc and by hand) are there plans to extend the projects on
> Hudson? or do other developers have their own continuous builds going at home? Might have to beg

Which of the actively developed swinglabs subprojects are missing from Hudson?
As far as I'm aware the only things we don't build are incubator and separate branches. Is there anything else you would want to have built?

> Jan for some of his settings if I go down that route. This is where I quite fancied the Maven option for
> each, as pulling from several projects and maintaining mixed sets of dependencies quickly
> becomes a chore.

I thought we agreed while ago that producing maven friendly output makes sense only for final deliverables (e.g. releases and milestone builds), but not for ongoing work. Did I miss the point?

Cheers,
Jan

osbald
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Joined: 2003-06-13
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> What exactly is slow? Checking for new versions of the files in CVS or getting new files?

The really painful thing is checking out a project or browsing the repository. Once I've got a copy I suspect updates are much the same in & out of the IDE.. although IDEA does have a habit of bringing back deleted folders & files. Never quite sure what to pass the various hosting cvs(es) cvs update -d -P ? If I don't have a local copy or mess things up with patches I tend to checkout again which is always a mistake as IDEA opens the whole top level before prompting for a project to checkout. Takes forever. Being based in Europe probably dosnt help as we're up & working before everybody else -- including the servers, some days .

> Which of the actively developed swinglabs subprojects are missing from Hudson?

I'm thinking swing-layout, swingworker, wizard, beansbinding, appframework etc.. It's not actually something I want/need to do continuously. More on demand. I've also got half a dozen other projects hosted on google-code, codehaus or sourgeforge etc.. and updating local copies is a chore.. just remembering the version control software, username & passwords and build tool/ commands / targets vary on each.. just one of those long standing PITAs, had a thought something like a local Hudson run periodically (ideally on manual request) might help.

> I thought we agreed while ago that producing maven friendly output makes sense only for final deliverables

It's agreed that we'd need the version numbers just to get going and snapshots aren't great for automatic downloads. Creating POMs for every project wouldn't be much fun (no standard project structures) and while in my head Maven would just work and answer all my problems - I suspect it'll actually shift the pain into keeping the individual POMs in harmony with one another (given that most are separate projects without an obvious parent).

Just thinking aloud as to how to make things easier.

- Richard

rah003
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Joined: 2004-05-26
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> The really painful thing is checking out a project or browsing the repository. Once I've got a copy I
> suspect updates are much the same in & out of the IDE.. although IDEA does have a habit of bringing
> back deleted folders & files. Never quite sure what to pass the various hosting cvs(es) cvs update -d -P
> ? If I don't have a local copy or mess things up with patches I tend to checkout again which is always a

Would not using cmd cvs client for initial checkouts solve this problem? (pls understand I'm not trying to play down your problem or anything, just trying to understand it better).
I could also imagine producing zip file with a copy of cvs project tree including cvs info as part of a weekly build so you could have your local backup copy always at most week old. To use such copy you would presumably have to replace checkout user id with your own ... but then again it sounds already as almost overkill.
Maybe there's a cvs proxy somewhere around (Although I haven't heard of any) to get files from closer to home ...

> mistake as IDEA opens the whole top level before prompting for a project to checkout. Takes forever.

Now the obvious question (but could not resist ;)) - did you file the bug or RFE with intellij about this already?

> Being based in Europe probably dosnt help as we're up & working before everybody else -- including the
> servers, some days .

Hmm, being on the same side of the pond a yourself I actually know exactly what you mean.

> subprojects are missing from Hudson?
> I'm thinking swing-layout, swingworker, wizard,
> beansbinding, appframework etc.. It's not actually

I'll talk about those with Rich when I manage to get hold of him and see what his opinion is. In principle I've no problem adding them all. Although it also means to get people in charge of those projects to let me or Rich to play a bit with their build scripts ...

> something I want/need to do continuously. More on demand. I've also got half a dozen other projects
> hosted on google-code, codehaus or sourgeforge etc.. and updating local copies is a chore.. just
> remembering the version control software, username & passwords and build tool/ commands / targets vary on
> each.. just one of those long standing PITAs, had a thought something like a local Hudson run
> periodically (ideally on manual request) might help.

I was actually contemplating setting up dedicated server for pulling all the stuff I'm interested in together from all over the world and having it always up to date when I need it myself no matter where I happen to be at that moment ... not ready to put it out in open yet, but maybe we can arrange something soon if there are more people interested.

> Just thinking aloud as to how to make things easier.
That's always good, just keep going.
J.

osbald
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Joined: 2003-06-13
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> Would not using cmd cvs client for initial checkouts solve this problem?

That's pretty much what I end up doing, but I keep forgetting which project is where and the wrong click in the IDE to browse the source can take an age to back out of.. I think using CVS in offline mode (an option in IDEA) would probably help while editing, esp. when the servers down. Do you always use -d -P with update? if I skip the prune I end up with old refactored dirs & packages and without -d there's no guarantees I've got everything (incubator changes mostly) . Both together seem to elongate the updates.

> Now the obvious question (but could not resist ;)) - did you file the bug or RFE with intellij about this already?

Of course (cough!) I could always try.. java.net is a bit of an oddity in that other project hosts tend to give each project their own VCS root. java.net just adds you to the top of an ever growing directory so it's getting worse with age. I think Eclipse just pages the projects list better if I remember rightly.

I like the idea of a local build system, although I'd prefer to do it on request (I have to pay for excessive bandwidth usage at home - cheapskate!) . I'd also like to back out (rollback) an update if it looks dodgy.. and have my project files (global/project libs) updated if successful which also doesn't quite fit into Hudson.

- Richard

rah003
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> esp. when the servers down. Do you always use -d -P
> with update? if I skip the prune I end up with old
yes I do use both. On top of it since I've got to go via firewall, I create ssh tunnel to cvs.java.net first and then use cvs through this tunnel. But I expect if anything it should just slow down the things.

> it's getting worse with age. I think Eclipse just
> pages the projects list better if I remember rightly.
I use Eclipse most of the time and I'm quite happy with the way it works with CVS.

> I like the idea of a local build system, although I'd
> prefer to do it on request (I have to pay for
> excessive bandwidth usage at home - cheapskate!) .
Wouldn't it be even better option for you then to do such package integration builds remotely and just cherry pick and download only those binaries (sources) which pass all of your selection criteria?

evickroy
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Joined: 2004-07-23
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Congrats to you both!

Which areas/components will you guys be focusing on?

Erik

osbald
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Joined: 2003-06-13
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> Which areas/components will you guys be focusing on?

Understanding. I think Richard and Jeanette must have been feeling a bit desperate ;)

I'm a bit pressed for time, so I've been reporting/fixing things as I go. So I've a bunch of fixes in my incubator I'd like to migrate if/when possible. Would like to understand the process (if any) I have to go through there. I've also got a vested interest in JXDatePicker so I suppose I've nominated myself for some of it's upkeep. (If anybodies got any suggestions let me know where you've filed them wiki? rfe issues?).

Aside from that I've also got a bunch of my own util methods and default models I've been using for years - would like to sit down and work of if/how/where they might fit into the project ~ where I'm not already overlapping with any of the existing classes or projects. I've tinkered with a couple of components in my incubator - but I'll need to get a better grip on creating delegates for them (if needed for composites) also need a better understanding what logic should live where, use lookandfeeladdons correctly, how to localise components etc.. seeing the optional package take shape (optional pegged for model implementations too?) would be great.

Talking of packages/projects I do find java.net CVS a bit of a pain to work with in IDEA ..with some many projects at the top level it's really slow - are there any aliases I can use instead? svn support?

Similarly It'd be useful for me to able able to keep several of the swinglabs projects and related jsrs up-to-date (currently I'm doing this ad-hoc and by hand) are there plans to extend the projects on Hudson? or do other developers have their own continuous builds going at home? Might have to beg Jan for some of his settings if I go down that route. This is where I quite fancied the Maven option for each, as pulling from several projects and maintaining mixed sets of dependencies quickly becomes a chore.

- Richard

kschaefe
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Joined: 2006-06-08
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> > Which areas/components will you guys be focusing
> on?
Good question. I asked Richard Bair the same one. I'm going to wait around a bit before trying to claim anything, but I've been working on the JXTreeTable a lot. I also have a few improvements that I want to see with the JXLoginPanel, including an accompanying Change Password panel. I believe that the code reuse between the two is high. I have a few convenience components in my incubator, which need some fleshing out. Mostly, I think I will try to tackle some of the outstanding bugs.

> I've also got a
> vested interest in JXDatePicker so I suppose I've
> nominated myself for some of it's upkeep. (If
> anybodies got any suggestions let me know where
> you've filed them wiki? rfe issues?).
I haven't filed this yet, but we really, really, really need to remove getEditor/setEditor. It's an invititation to mess with the implementation details of the component and as we've seen (in posts on this board) an invitation to break the Date contract established by the component, as it allows the user to bypass setFormats. I also believe that JXDatePickerFormatter should not be public. Again, it's an implementation detail.

> Talking of packages/projects I do find java.net CVS a
> bit of a pain to work with in IDEA ..with some many
> projects at the top level it's really slow - are
> there any aliases I can use instead? svn support?
I use Eclipse, so no help there. But I can tell you that the project cannot switch to svn easily. From what I've read, it would require abandoning this project and starting a fresh one using svn instead of cvs.

Karl

osbald
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Thanks guys, your going to have to double-check who you're talking to now there's more than one Filthy Rich on the team.

- Richard v2.0

kschaefe
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Joined: 2006-06-08
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> I'd like to welcome Richard Osbaldeston and Karl
> Schaefe(r?) as our two most recent SwingX committers.
> We've watched their contributions for a while and
> think they'll make a great addition to the team.
Yes, with an r. If it wasn't for UNIX 8 character limit for user ids, and my unwillingness to give up on the id, it might have been more clear. ;)

Thanks for the welcome. Now, back to J1.

Karl Schaefer