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need direction

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ldp
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Joined: 2007-02-21

Hello,

I need expert advice on moving first steps towards a toy project, to learn about this technology.

These are the requirements.
A small java application that must run on any handheld device, including compatible mobile phones and PDAs. The application reads two strings, stores them into a local file [db], and returns a confirmation message on screen. Both the application and the db must be obfuscated, with a means to de-obfuscate the db once sent back to a desktop. The gui must take the full screen and adapt to its size on the fly.

My development tools.
operating systems: mac osx, linux

My testing tools.
HP iPaq 4150
Nokia phone serie60

I need direction on what documentation to read, a source code I can read and play with, and the necessary java mobile development kit. I kept reading the website, but I got lost in the pages. Is there a "down to earth" "how to" "step by step" whatever to get started?

Thank you.

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ldp
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Joined: 2007-02-21

http://java.sun.com/javaone/sf/media_shell.jsp?id=193609

It is a mock of Steve Jobs's presentation format.
It even mocks the way he dresses, but badly.
It is also an ugly presentation: slow and cluttered.

Java FX Mobile... looks like a step forward, but
the demo clearly shows how slow JAVA still is.

The presentation made no reference to J2ME.
What happened to J2ME? Did JFXM kill J2ME?
If not, why not?

Overall, it is a rather confusing show. If one
ignores all the clutter, however, and closes
one eye to the speed factor, once can only
appreciate SUN's interest in making JAVA
easier, faster, and more widely available.

The presentation used Apple desktops, but
said nothing about the development kit...

I hope the next JavaOne will be better
prepared, with mature technology,
and a cross-platform JDK.

ldp
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Joined: 2007-02-21

I spotted this interesting review, and I thought you might find it of interest too.

"An empirical comparison of C, C++, Java, Perl, Python, Rexx, and Tcl",
by Lutz Prechelt, IEEE Computer 33(10):23-29, October 2000.

LdP

ldp
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Joined: 2007-02-21

I settled with netbeans for linux.

stuart_marks
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Joined: 2006-08-24

Netbeans for linux is a good start. I like MacOS but unfortunately our stuff isn't supported there. Be sure to try out NetBeans Mobility Pack:

http://www.netbeans.org/products/mobility/
http://www.netbeans.org/kb/55/quickstart-mobility.html

A useful adjoint to NetBeans is the Sun Java Wireless Toolkit. Version 2.5 unfortunately runs only on Windows, but the prior version (2.2) runs on Linux as well. (Support for 2.5 on Linux is planned for the near future.) Actually the Toolkit should be pre-integrated into NetBeans Mobility Pack so if that works for you, great. If you want to try out versions of the Toolkit standalone, go here:

http://java.sun.com/products/sjwtoolkit/download-2_5.html
http://java.sun.com/products/sjwtoolkit/download-2_2.html

Also, you might try reading through the Getting Started guide for phoneME:

https://phoneme.dev.java.net/content/index_feature.html

Yeah, it's rather hard to find. I had to hunt around for it myself.

s'marks

ldp
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Joined: 2007-02-21

I realise that J2ME it is nothing like I hoped it to be. JAVA's philosophy is not true to itself here. At first, I thought that a little JAVA application could be compiled anywhere and also run on mobile phone, only to realize that I needed a specific kit, that there is no single one, none for OSX, and on top of it, now that I tried a few, the application still does not run on the devices I have. At the end of the struggle, to write a program that only runs on a certain device is worse than writing for a specific OS, which might be the reason for the limited deployement of this technology. There should be a single standard VM on all devices. If SUN is serious about JAVA, there should be one JDK too, available in JAVA and thus run everywhere. This was the key point with C. The latest version of JAVA is only properly available for Microsoft Windows, which defies the whole point with this language. I am sorry to sound so dramatic. Will JAVA collapse under its own weight, running only on desktop windows?

stuart_marks
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Joined: 2006-08-24

Hi ldp,

I'm sorry you're disappointed with the state of Java. It really would be nice for there to be a single version of Java that runs identically everywhere. As you observed, this isn't the case.

Rest assured that Sun is serious about Java. The lack of the same version of Java on all devices is one of the reasons we open sourced it. Everyone will be much better off, I think, if we can get people all to work on the same version instead of everybody working on their own versions. This is virtually impossible in a proprietary software world, but it at least is possible in an open source world. It doesn't happen automatically though.

When you say "the latest version of Java is only properly available for Microsoft Windows" do you mean the Java Wireless Toolkit 2.5 that was just released? If so, yes, I agree it's irritating that it's Windows only. However, we do have a Linux version in the works; it should be out in a couple months. It would be nice if it ran on the Macintosh (I'm a Mac user myself) but unfortunately it doesn't. The fact is that it's expensive to support additional platforms, and the WTK team made the decision to roll out on Windows first and Linux second. We've had some internal discussions about Mac support but demand has never been large enough to justify supporting it.

If you're still having trouble getting your application to run on the devices you have, you might try posting in the ME Interest forum:

http://forums.java.net/jive/forum.jspa?forumID=105&start=0

The folks over there have quite a bit of experience with different devices. Again, it's unfortunate that things don't work everywhere immediately, but it is certainly possible to get the same code running on multiple devices.

s'marks

joshasbury
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Joined: 2003-08-04

As I sit here in a bean bag chair at JavaOne tapping away on my MacBook Pro in the Alumni lounge, I count 10 MacBook pro users out of about 20 people working on laptops here. That's quite a percentage for a platform that hasn't justified the demand...

I, too, am disappointed in the Java support for Mac and am wondering what options I have to address my mobility development needs. Maybe it's time for me to abandon ME development in favor of something else. JavaFX looks pretty enticing, but I am assuming that Mac developers will face the same issues with lack of support...